EZS poor quality/ quantity DK

rosenmarie · June 22, 2025 at 11:24 AM New

Hello,

I am currently looking for a suitable clinic abroad for double donation. I was initially in favor of Denmark. But in recent months, there have been so many negative reports in forums and on social media that I am very unsettled and have little confidence in the clinics. Numerous women report miscarriages/MA before gestational week 12, the number of blastocysts is absurdly low (sometimes only 1 blastocyst ), the quality is rather BC than AB/BA, sometimes even CC. Some of the donors were stimulated too much, which also led to a drop in quality. And the most unbelievable thing: clinics (including Diers and Sellmer) have increasingly divided the "yield" of a donor in fresh transfer among several patients.

I ask myself: How can I be sure that my chosen clinic is not doing this? What questions do I need to ask from a medical point of view to rule out such a procedure?

Thank you in advance for an honest answer.

Teska · June 24, 2025 at 3:28 PM New

Hello,

very interesting what you write, but I would be interested in the sources or in these forums or social media, who or what indicates this there? Doctors? Donors? Patients?

I am also being treated in DK, and I also had an MA before the 12th week of pregnancy, actually in the 8th week of pregnancy. I am happy with my clinic and don't blame them for the MA. It's bad and it hurts, but I have the feeling that it's not the clinic's fault, just as it's not my fault. The clinic was always there to help and advise me and we also felt comfortable on site. I write them an email and get an answer as quickly as possible, both during the pregnancy and afterwards.

When you're in a situation like mine, you suddenly find out that it feels like every second woman around you has already had a miscarriage - and that with a natural pregnancy. But nobody talks about it. My mother alone had 3 between my older sister and me. A good friend of mine lost her child in the 9SSW, as did my colleague at work. All natural pregnancies. Ask a midwife how many women have been/are being treated by her who have had a miscarriage. Or how many women didn't even realize they were pregnant and just thought "oh, I'm stressed, well, then my period will come a few days later" and it was a miscarriage.

How do you know that donors were overstimulated? Or who determined that the stimulation of donor XY was too high?

And how do we know that the yield from donor YX was divided among several recipients?

This is all information that you can only have if you have internal information from the respective clinics - i.e. quasi employees or ex-employees.

Or am I seeing this wrong?

In CZ there are clinics that promise 4 blastocysts in one package, how do you know that all 4 are from one donor??? You can (theoretically) get 4 different ones.

The business of having children abroad is booming and there are black sheep in every industry.

You have to decide for yourself which clinic is right for you, as other factors (distance, type of treatment, open/closed donation, etc.) also play a role.

rosenmarie · June 24, 2025 at 3:46 PM New

Hi Teska,

I can answer your questions as far as possible (with regard to data protection and knowledge limits ).

The information comes directly from patients and has been shared and discussed by them in forums and Facebook groups, sometimes with US pictures etc. I will not mention any names here. Some of the doctors/clinics have responded, some have not. Dr. Peet advised one of the patients to change her donor. For example, there have been several women with miscarriages after transfer by egg donation with one and the same donor. One of them had two miscarriages. This means that at least four pregnancies from this one donor resulted in early miscarriages. The donor should therefore have been blocked. However, she is still offered. Note: Donors have numbers/alias and can also be easily "identified", especially according to rare phenotypes; puncture data is also an indication.

Two recipients know from the clinic that the eggs from a stimulation were split. However, this was discussed differently beforehand and, in my opinion, would be a breach of contract and an abuse of power. After all, what is left for the customers?

In another case, "we never actually do it" was communicated by the clinic in advance and then came out in conversation and was confirmed by the clinic afterwards when asked.

Overstimulation can be recognized by the number of punctured eggs and the quality (fertilization rate/development of the eggs).

The risk of miscarriage is - depending on what you count - 15 to 50 percent in the first few weeks. With egg donation, this should be significantly lower... which is why you go down this route.

rosenmarie · June 24, 2025 at 4:15 PM New

By the way: A miscarriage was examined and monosomy X was diagnosed.

Saasa · June 24, 2025 at 4:34 PM New

Okey, so the conclusion is - Denmark is bad ?

Unfortunately, I'm very pragmatic.

What would you advise me to do? rosenmarie

rosenmarie · June 24, 2025 at 4:51 PM New

Saasa Yes, such information and cases are becoming more frequent in Danish clinics. But this is partly due to the non-genetically tested donors and partly due to the old problem of "higher demand & lower supply".

I don't think that Denmark has bad clinics in general. For me, it's just not the right country because no genetic testing is done here. This is confirmed by these cases, which are currently piling up. I've already had too many losses and I'm going this route to save myself a lot. It makes no sense to me to choose untested donors. Does that make sense? I think the decision for a country (later a clinic) is very individual and so are the criteria.

- open/closed donation?

- Genetically tested/untested donors? (possibly option for PGT-A?)

- Fresh transfer or embryo donation?

- Language/ interpreter on site?

- In my case, treatment of single women as a prerequisite

Teska · June 24, 2025 at 5:31 PM New

Administrator what is your opinion on this? You have much more experience and hear and see more than the "normal" mortal

C+C_Schmid · June 24, 2025 at 8:19 PM New Official Post

Hello lovelies,

Denmark is certainly not bad per se. From a legal point of view, PGT is a problem, and we can't change that. Just today I recorded a podcast with Dr. Nitzschke where we discussed the topic of egg donation and PGT. In his opinion, this is actually money-making. According to him, the rate of misdiagnosis in PGT is also relatively high, meaning that some healthy, euploid embryos are also discarded.

He would generally advise against PGT for egg donation unless there are problems with the male factor.

The popularity of Danish fertility clinics has increased significantly in the last two years, and of course there must be enough donors.

In my time, 20 years ago, we faced the same problem: in the beginning, you always got all the eggs from one donor, then, regardless of the country, there were fewer donors than necessary, so the clinics switched to egg sharing. The eggs were then divided up, and in some clinics there were up to 4 recipient pairs for every donor. After a while, the couples insisted on receiving all the eggs from one donor, and then the clinics moved away from egg sharing again.

We have visited many clinics so far and are traveling for you again this year, so of course we will include this question.

The choice of clinic is so individual, there are countless factors, we now take more than 100 factors into account in our consultation when choosing a clinic.

LG

Claudia & Chris

C+C_Schmid · June 24, 2025 at 8:50 PM New Official Post

We have forgotten one more thing,

if you have these problems with one of our partner clinics, please let us know. We will then take the liberty of confronting them with your statements and would like an explanation.

We have already been able to help some of you successfully, and there have also been positive financial results.

So let us know, we will be happy to help you.

LG

Claudia & Chris

rosenmarie · June 25, 2025 at 2:32 PM New

Dear Claudia & Chris,

Thank you for your assessment. I am still wondering how I can rule out the possibility that my clinic is acting differently than previously discussed.

And more importantly:

What questions can I ask from a medical point of view to rule out or at least reduce the risk of poor quality DC, for example due to overstimulation or burdened donors? Which genetic tests should donors undergo? What is the European "gold standard" and where can I find it? Which country with open donation is top of the range here?

I would be delighted if my questions were answered. Thanks

C+C_Schmid · June 25, 2025 at 6:10 PM New Official Post

rosenmarie Open donation (more precise definition: Open ID donation); country of choice in Europe: Denmark or Finland (still very unknown and not very crowded, therefore little information)

LG

Claudia & Chris

Fliege · June 25, 2025 at 8:37 PM New

I myself was in the Czech Republic, Denmark was simply out of the question after my research on price/performance. I also wanted an open donation at first, but after weighing up the costs and benefits for a long time, I had to make a compromise at some point and opted for Prague.

So I can't say much about it. Have you researched Cape Town? I don't know if they treat singles or just couples and I don't know if they are open/anonymous. But they used to be very successful many years ago, they speak German and you can at least look at baby photos, like at DK.

Unfortunately, I don't know if that helps.

rosenmarie · June 25, 2025 at 10:57 PM New

C+C_Schmid As I said, Dk is not acceptable to me and not a country of choice. Here I take a higher risk, which I want to minimize. On top of that, I get less for more money. As Fliege says: the price-performance ratio is not right here.

Fliege Yes, Prague would also be my choice if I could make an open donation there. Actually only couples are treated, but a signature is often enough. Cape Town would be a good idea. I looked again to see why South Africa got kicked out. Apparently they don't offer open donation, although not really regulated.

I'm currently talking to clinics in Portugal and Greece... let's see

C+C_Schmid · June 27, 2025 at 1:58 PM New Official Post

rosenmarie That was just a statement about which countries are currently standard for Open ID donation, Greece has only been offering it since 2024 and we keep hearing from Greek clinics that they hardly have any donors for Open ID.

I was in South Africa myself for 4 or 5 cycles, always a good alternative for me, I would just have to do some research about Open ID.

Regards

Chris

C+C_Schmid · June 30, 2025 at 5:38 PM New Official Post

rosenmarie

Could you please write the clinic or clinics here, or even privately. Unfortunately, the article has led to a lot of uncertainty, as it generalizes and definitely not all clinics in Denmark are bad. You would be helping to put everything into perspective. As I said, if they are partner clinics of ours, it is even more important that they are named so that we can discuss this with the clinics.

In general, don't be put off, not every clinic is bad. Despite everything, trust your gut feeling.

LG

Claudia and Chris

C+C_Schmid · July 5, 2025 at 4:48 PM New Official Post

To all,

We are closing this thread here. It has caused extreme uncertainty among the members, as it was very generalized. Repeated requests to name the clinics, even privately, have unfortunately been unsuccessful.

That's not nice. There are always problems with clinics, but please name the clinic specifically, because if they are partner clinics, we see it as our responsibility to address the problems there directly and find a solution.
Even if it is not a partner clinic, we would contact the clinic and address the problem.

So please, no more generalized condemnations, that doesn't help anyone.

LG

Claudia & Chris

Ninusch84 · July 5, 2025 at 5:03 PM New

Hi Chris,

I just wanted to confirm that the Sellmer Clinic splits eggs when many are punctured. An exact guideline was not given. However, this was explicitly pointed out during the initial consultation. So you know what you are getting into.
It might be interesting for future couples to know at what point the number of eggs is divided and whether they are informed about the division at all.

However, we are very happy with the clinic.
LG

Ninusch84 · July 5, 2025 at 5:04 PM New

And hello Claudia of course;)

Saasa · July 6, 2025 at 5:35 AM New

Good morning everyone,

The question now arises as to whether this would also be the case with DIERS ? Is there any experience of this?

Many thanks to Ninusch, in principle I don't think it's a bad thing to share - the only question is to what extent this can lead to disadvantages. So far I have only heard positive things about the Sellmer Clinic.

Teska · July 6, 2025 at 9:26 AM New

Quote from Ninusch84

Hi Chris,

I just wanted to confirm that the Sellmer Clinic splits eggs when many are punctured. An exact guideline was not given. However, this was explicitly pointed out during the initial consultation. So you know what you are getting into.
It might be interesting for future couples to know at what point the number of eggs is divided and whether they are informed about the division at all.

However, we are very happy with the clinic.
LG

Ninusch84 when did you have this conversation? It wasn't mentioned during our video call in August 24 and the on-site examination in October 24.

I am also satisfied with the Sellmer Klinik